My rant on old cars and modern car culture

So first off, I know we are having website trouble, I'm sorry and I'm working on it!

To everyone with a newer car, this rant is not aimed towards you in a negative way. I love many cars made in the last few years, I think many of you who know me know that fact. The point instead of this is to explain my personal views on modern car culture and it's relation to both modified and motorsport history. Remember, these are simply my opinions and I know some of you will probably disagree, that's fine and in fact that's awesome because I want to know what you think!

I've spend a decent amount of time on automotive forums of all types. I've also been around cars long enough to watch the different trends and fads come and go. When the sport compact scene exploded, it couldn't have come at a better time. By the time F&F came out, many people had access to the internet and the ability to share information was greatly increased. Overnight, suddenly modified car culture in the states was renewed and rejuvenated. This is not to say that it didn't exist before but it was not nearly as strong. Many of us look back on those times and make jokes about the cars and the styles. The problem is however that, that movement forever set the sport compact ship in a direction not similar whatsoever with its roots. Let us not forget, modified car culture has heavy ties in motorsports. Lets go back another decade to the early 1990s. This was the very beginning of modified sport compacts here in the states. It was kids out in California building whatever small, lightweight cars they could get their hands on. Why were they not building Fox body Mustangs or third gen Camaros's? After all, these were the most powerful cars around at the time. The answer lies in the spirit of motorsport that was brought over from Japan and Europe, they wanted to build cars that could handle. There was another problem of the time however, parts for these cars were not widely available. The stuff you could get had to come from Japan and it was expensive. So what was done? They were forced to use already existing usdm parts from other models or fabricate new parts that gave them the performance increase necessary to run in the mountains. I know it sounds cheezy "run in the mountians" but in reality, that's what many of these cars were originally built for.

Back to 2011, we are in a very dynamic and fast paced car world. Yet the more time I spend on various forums, I find it harder and harder to get excited by their content. The aim these days seems to be, who has the newest, shiniest, cleanest car. If it has big wheels and makes lots o power that doesn't hurt ones cred either. It would then appear to me that performance car culture has become simply a giant rat race to e-popularity. How high on this ladder of automotive artwork can you go? How unique a piece of steel can you build? Power and suspension modifications have become nothing more than tools used to propel ones self up this ladder. I often wonder what most of these modern "enthusiasts" think about before shutting there eyes at night? I have a hard time imagining. Is it installing shiny new parts or maybe "cruising" around town with buddies? Anybody who spends an extended period of time modifying a car will eventually flat line. People flat line for various reasons but everyone does and when they do usually one of three things will happen. #1 they will sell the car and buy a new project, #2 they will keep the car and use it for basic transportation while dreaming of what they would do if they had more money/time/interest, or #3 they will have built the car as a tool for a specific task instead of a means to an end. You may be asking now, what the hell is Nick talking about? Too many of my car enthusiast brothers and sisters have only seen the light side of the moon. Of course there is the car, we all love our cars. There is also however what you do with the car. If you allow yourself to become immersed in driving as an art form, as a sport, and as a hobby, only then are you truly in the game. A car can only take you as far as you drive it, after all isn't driving at the heart of car love. If you couldn't drive it, I doubt you would want to spend your whole paycheck on it.

The saddest part, however of modern car culture is how segregated it has become. I remember how tight the whole culture used to be. If you saw someone driving anything modified it was a waive. Sometimes even, you would stop and talk and just talking to other car guys was tight. But these days, it's worse than ever. You can be in a slammed n jammed, clean as hell EG hatch and a modified STI will cruise right past without a look. Only complicating things is the fact that a visually modified car (especially with newer cars), is no longer a sign that the owner is a car geek. In this regard, It truly brings pain to my heart to think of the small number of older cars I see that are enthusiast owned and built. Usually older cars I see that have any modifications are owned by people who know very little about cars and instead simply can't afford anything more expensive to ruin. It would then seem that everyone who has money to buy and modify an older car, chooses instead to buy newer and faster. I can't say I don't understand, after owning two hand fulls of old cars I understand that they take a lot of work to maintain much less modify. For that reason alone, I can not expect everyone to choose the same path as me. Instead though, I present the idea that from time to time, we as inheritors of this culture and hobby that brings so many of us joy owe it to ourselves and our automotive elders to pay a bit of homage, and never forget why and how we got here.

/rant

Modlists are a forumgoers way of saying, "I crave male attention." I'm okay being made fun of for spending more time in my car's driver seat than replacing my wheels and finding the perfect ride height for that fresh-out-the-Sonic-parking-lot look.

Tuning small cars and trying to make them go fast and handle well started in the US in the 1920's! Getcher facts straight. I had a few old mountain racer friends in CO who liked to tell stories of the Novas and Mustang II's they used to bring to the canyons.

With any hobby you're going to find that casuals outnumber diehards 10-to-1. You and I will still like fast cars in a few years... most of the hellaflush kids are going to disappear or move onto the next fashion, whether it be double-decker wings again or some new way of making your car not work as well for a lot of money. My suggestion is to sit back and quietly assess them, compare their mistakes to yours, learn from their willingness to attach stupid shit to their cars, and try to focus on YOUR passion for cars, not their lack of it.

dogbreath wrote:

Modlists are a forumgoers way of saying, "I crave male attention." I'm okay being made fun of for spending more time in my car's driver seat than replacing my wheels and finding the perfect ride height for that fresh-out-the-Sonic-parking-lot look.

Tuning small cars and trying to make them go fast and handle well started in the US in the 1920's! Getcher facts straight. I had a few old mountain racer friends in CO who liked to tell stories of the Novas and Mustang II's they used to bring to the canyons.

With any hobby you're going to find that casuals outnumber diehards 10-to-1. You and I will still like fast cars in a few years... most of the hellaflush kids are going to disappear or move onto the next fashion, whether it be double-decker wings again or some new way of making your car not work as well for a lot of money. My suggestion is to sit back and quietly assess them, compare their mistakes to yours, learn from their willingness to attach stupid shit to their cars, and try to focus on YOUR passion for cars, not their lack of it.

I like aftermarket parts as much as anyone, I just add parts because they will make it better at something. "Fresh out the Sonic parking lot look" I also of course want my car to look minty, I just would never sacrifice looks for performance.

I've never had an aesthetic sensibility, I don't think I've ever had a car look 'minty.' My E36 was missing a turn signal in front which was usually replaced with a Sonic cup or an empty pack of Newports.

you know, this happens in all subcultures. to put it simply, i think if you do what makes you happy, then more power to you - all these hellaflush kids or whatever your culture of choice it is to hate on isn't really affecting what you are doing - does it matter too much? i know it's tempting to look down on other people that don't ascribe to your set of standards, and maybe your point of view is totally valid. but i think it's mostly a waste of time to rant about it unless you are trying to do something about it (like creating your own car forum to create a new environment for like-minded people - but at the same time it i think things shouldn't be taken so seriously - it's a passion, we do it because it's fun and we love it. if you've ever been on corner-carvers - it's so tense and any newbie gets bashed to all hell with everyone's holier-than-thou attitude. it's not a nice place to be, even though it's a great resource for "real tech")

besides some people get the same pleasure you get driving your car hard and enjoying it as a car when they simply dress up their car and have something nice to look at or something to flex. yeah there's lots of nut swingers, and i agree that a lot of build threads are "look at me!" - i deleted my mod lists from some sites because of this. but at the same time i think it's a good way to track progress and they are helpful to other people looking for similar setups/impressions... and sometimes i forget what i've done to my car (since i actually keep my cars for several years unlike some people that troll car forums haha!).

yeah, you can always feel like people are not as devoted to cars as you - but everyone is on different levels. i know i started out with simple ricer mods and now i'm trying to build a stupid race car - just out of curiosity and to learn how to work on more things quickly (the original plan was to learn how to do things step by step on the ms3 when upgrading/replacing things slowly - so when i get a nicer car in the future i can do my own maintenance if i have to). i know i get a lot of satisfaction just from knowing how to fix something and actually doing it myself. i haven't jumped totally into the driving portion of it yet (even though i do love driving and really want to learn to drive a lot better) due to timing and maybe some concern of messing up the dd. and hell, if i'm looking at it and driving it everyday, why not make it look nice? so i'm going to disagree with you there - i don't think you HAVE to be into motorsport to be a "true car enthusiast". do you have to play an instrument to truly appreciate music? do you have to be an artist to appreciate art? do you have to play football to be a "true football fan"? people enjoy things in different ways, i don't think one way is necessarily "more true" than another.

what do you think about people that keep their large collection of cars garaged and babied? they probably are as enthusiastic about cars as the next person, but they show it differently. also what about the people that strive to make their cars concourse-ready? they are sacrificing performance that they could have with aftermarket parts for oem looks and performance. it's all style and preferences, different things make people happy and proud of their cars. i know plenty of people who spend whole paychecks on things they just can look at and not "use"... cars included (how many people dump money into projects and let them sit in the garage - even when they are finished or just to have something in the garage to think about?) i like looks almost as much as performance, i think the some of ultimate forms come from function though - so sacrifice shouldn't always be necessary - beautiful things are born out of the need for function if they are designed correctly. but that's another discussion...

the only thing i absolutely do not tolerate is people who don't make any effort to know what their doing to their car or any effort to understand the effects the mods will have on their car. that's just being stupid and feel free to hate away i know what it's like when something you love becomes popular and bastardized by the masses though - but it will pass and the enthusiasts will always remain - so just keep doing what you're doing and share your passion with other people - people that are really interested will follow and continue the enthusiasm

xcoldricex wrote:

you know, this happens in all subcultures. to put it simply, i think if you do what makes you happy, then more power to you - all these hellaflush kids or whatever your culture of choice it is to hate on isn't really affecting what you are doing - does it matter too much? i know it's tempting to look down on other people that don't ascribe to your set of standards, and maybe your point of view is totally valid. but i think it's mostly a waste of time to rant about it unless you are trying to do something about it (like creating your own car forum to create a new environment for like-minded people - but at the same time it i think things shouldn't be taken so seriously - it's a passion, we do it because it's fun and we love it. if you've ever been on corner-carvers - it's so tense and any newbie gets bashed to all hell with everyone's holier-than-thou attitude. it's not a nice place to be, even though it's a great resource for "real tech")

You have a point, and I may take my opinion on the issue a bit far some of the time. With that said however, I feel the need to be loud because we are in the minority. I also understand it may seem stupid to look at the issue from an us vs. them perspective but I should make it clear what I mean when I say us and them. I have no problem with people who like different types of car stuff. Guys who like drag cars, drift cars, restoring older cars, ect. that is all perfectly fine, anyways who am I to judge people on their car interest. I simply feel like the number of people who are fascinated by performance designed street cars like I am, are getting smaller and smaller as this new scene emerges. And I am not an anti hella flush guy either, I think it is cool, I think it looks great, I just fail to understand why that it has become popular beyond the point of being functional.

besides some people get the same pleasure you get driving your car hard and enjoying it as a car when they simply dress up their car and have something nice to look at or something to flex. yeah there's lots of nut swingers, and i agree that a lot of build threads are "look at me!" - i deleted my mod lists from some sites because of this. but at the same time i think it's a good way to track progress and they are helpful to other people looking for similar setups/impressions... and sometimes i forget what i've done to my car (since i actually keep my cars for several years unlike some people that troll car forums haha!).

I also have no problem with people showing off their cars or making awesome build threads, I love reading and getting inspiration from them. Hell if I ever get the Supra making some power I'll certainly show it off. What I can't stand however is when I read somebody's "mod list" on their ultra cool saabaru and the shit just doesn't make sense. But whatever, I suppose its not my problem.

yeah, you can always feel like people are not as devoted to cars as you - but everyone is on different levels. i know i started out with simple ricer mods and now i'm trying to build a stupid race car - just out of curiosity and to learn how to work on more things quickly (the original plan was to learn how to do things step by step on the ms3 when upgrading/replacing things slowly - so when i get a nicer car in the future i can do my own maintenance if i have to). i know i get a lot of satisfaction just from knowing how to fix something and actually doing it myself. i haven't jumped totally into the driving portion of it yet (even though i do love driving and really want to learn to drive a lot better) due to timing and maybe some concern of messing up the dd. and hell, if i'm looking at it and driving it everyday, why not make it look nice? so i'm going to disagree with you there - i don't think you HAVE to be into motorsport to be a "true car enthusiast". do you have to play an instrument to truly appreciate music? do you have to be an artist to appreciate art? do you have to play football to be a "true football fan"? people enjoy things in different ways, i don't think one way is necessarily "more true" than another.

No doubt, just because you are into cars does not mean you have to be into motorsports. But when you modify a performance car, say an Sti or a Supra, and you add parts that, in origin were designed for track use and make your car less comfortable to drive and less reliable, yet you have not even a slight interest in racing even as a fan, I'm sorry but that to me doesn't make sense. To use your analogy, that's like someone who plays Rec & Ed baseball but doesn't care to know or learn about baseball. If someone doesn't care about racing, but still wants a cool car, and is still a car person, they should go out and buy whatever they want, be it an evo or a 350z. But for the love of god, don't throw away 10, 15, 20 grand on parts that you will never use. That is just foolish.

what do you think about people that keep their large collection of cars garaged and babied? they probably are as enthusiastic about cars as the next person, but they show it differently. also what about the people that strive to make their cars concourse-ready? they are sacrificing performance that they could have with aftermarket parts for oem looks and performance. it's all style and preferences, different things make people happy and proud of their cars. i know plenty of people who spend whole paychecks on things they just can look at and not "use"... cars included (how many people dump money into projects and let them sit in the garage - even when they are finished or just to have something in the garage to think about?) i like looks almost as much as performance, i think the some of ultimate forms come from function though - so sacrifice shouldn't always be necessary - beautiful things are born out of the need for function if they are designed correctly. but that's another discussion...

Well I agree with this part 100%. Your last sentience however is the basis of my whole argument. A car to me looks cool when I know it was built do something well, especially race. I'm not super into off roading but I love done up jeeps and such, but that is because they have a purpose. To me, building a car to look good doesn't count because you can not say, "this car looks good because I built it to look good". That is circular and IMO, doesn't fly. But of course it is just my opinion and that is why we have these conversations .

the only thing i absolutely do not tolerate is people who don't make any effort to know what their doing to their car or any effort to understand the effects the mods will have on their car. that's just being stupid and feel free to hate away i know what it's like when something you love becomes popular and bastardized by the masses though - but it will pass and the enthusiasts will always remain - so just keep doing what you're doing and share your passion with other people - people that are really interested will follow and continue the enthusiasm

[b]

If you guy's haven't noticed from my posting in the "Hellaflush etc.." thread, I love all different kinds of cars. I've posted American, Japanese, Euro, old, new, flush, functional, track ready, show car etc... but the category I don't like is unfunctional. This is kind of obvious and is what most of us agree to. I can definitely understand a car that is so pristine that it is only driven the first Sunday of every month and to car shows, but when a car needs to be towed to a car show, that is ridiculous. If it needs to be towed to a car show, is it really a car? A car is meant to get you to point A to B, and obviously that car doesn't. I also don't understand Hellaflush. Now I'm talking major stretch, with the fender right in between the tire and the rim of the wheel, with -5 degree's of camber. There is a thread on the Mazda forums, where on the same page they have a post saying their car is functional, and another post saying their rear bumper scrapes the little bump getting out of his garage to his driveway. So, I guess people have a different view of "functional." Some say, if a car can drive down the street and back, it is functional. The kind of car modders on this forum have a different view. How can you justify suspension mods being functional if you can't turn fast enough to feel any improvement with out your tire shredding your fender?

It really is too bad that there are so many "fads" that come and go in the car world. Once F&F come's out, everyone loved body kits, neon's, and other ricer shit, and now all of the sudden people are getting "hated" on for putting an exterior mod on their car. There have been several people that tell me my wheels are too played out, because there are so many people with mesh wheels on the Fusion club, and in the car world in general, and they say I shouldn't have gotten those wheels. In reality, I've wanted mesh wheels for YEARS and at least for my first set of aftermarket wheels, I was not going to get anything other than mesh. Car's would be so much more unique if everyone did what they really wanted, not what is popular.

There is also a difference in the attitudes between the true car guys/gals, and the "wantabes." I don't want to sound stereotypical with the names of the groups, but that's just what fits best. The people who are on this forum, and other forum's alike and such are so much more genuine than the other group. We all can talk to each other on a deeper level, and we take criticism from others. We are more willing to help each other, and can discuss topics on a mature level. There are a few certain people who are part of the "other" group, and try to talk cars to me. They never listen to my criticism, even though it is completely constructive criticism. They tell me to put neon's on my car, and after I give them a true explanation on why I do not think neon's would look clean on my car they call me a hater. Our conversations usually end up with an argument, they try to tell me how the Lexus IS-F can be a manual, and I argue that it is an automatic that you have the ability to tell when to shift.

I do not think that you NEED to be involved in motorsports to be a true car enthusiast. However, if you are an enthusiast, and you are not involved in motorsports than you truly are missing out. It is a good way to get connected with your car, figure out how it handles, what it's capable of, and it increases your driving knowledge which will also help on the street. I can, however, understand how people do suspension mod's, but never take their car to the track. I'm not saying I would do that in the future, but when I first started modding my car, I got springs, then a strut brace, then Koni Yellows. I had spent over $700 and did not even intend on taking it to the track until years later. I then went autocrossing, had a blast, did relatively well, and it changed my outlook on modding. When I first started, I pretty much just modded to mod! In the car world, you get flamed for being at stock height, so I got springs. I wanted my car to look cool so I got rims, etc... but when I went autocrossing, I realized how the performance shocks I purchased helped the handling so much. I then started to mod for a purpose. I now have coilovers (set higher than my previous springs) and a rear sway bar, and my suspension now feels 10 times better than my old setup. Every turn I take put's a smile on my face.

The only way I've ever modified vehicles for performance is by taking a bunch of parts off of them.

This is what a Hayabusa looks like stock, compared to what mine looked like.





And again, stock Dakota next to mine.






Both of those were built for specific races and won those races, all of the modifications were free or profitable!

'busa looks great stripped down. dakota, not so much

xcoldricex wrote:

'busa looks great stripped down. dakota, not so much

Looked pretty good from the top of the podium

Haha the Dakota looks funny but you have balls of steel for driving that without harnesses and no doors

Wallace wrote:

without harnesses and no doors

Still has more safety features than a motorcycle

Haha this is true.

http://speedhunters.com/archive/2011/07/11/discussion-gt-gt-the-state-of-tuning-2011.aspx